Question about rural setup + upload speeds

[blobfish]

Hello! If anyone could please advise we'd be very grateful!

-My mother lives in a rural place and uses Ziply, speeds are very consistent at around 2.4/.61 for up/down.
-On her phone (using the nearest t mobile tower, about 3 miles away though no LOS as lots of trees) she frequently gets 22+/1. (Sometimes download is as low as 1.xx but usually is well over 20, or 10-15 in certain rooms)
-Goal: wifi in the home of at least 20 down and 3 up, probably using a T mobile Magenta Max plan as they have unlimited 4g and clearly decent coverage for this area (at $85 per month).

From reading this forum, I've gathered this is what we need to do:

-Order a router and a modem (and possibly some wires - but definitely select one that has a guide on this website)
-Order the Magenta Max sim and use an old smartphone to connect to the router/modem
-Use the guides on this website to setup the phone so that it can connect to the wifi router without thinking it's hotspotting or connected to a router.
-If speeds are still insufficient, we can add an antenna (and probably have to get a weatherproof box for the modem to go outside)

Is that about the size of it?? In addition, I have some questions, if someone could please answer them it'd really help:

1) Upload speeds - Because a router should (I imagine) have a stronger internal antenna than my mother's phone, is it possible to expect higher upload speeds? And if the router doesn't cut it, would an antenna help with upload speeds?

I understand that upload speed is affected by your ISP and not necessarily your equipment, but T Mobile says on its website (for 4G LTE Network On Device): Upload Speed: Upload Speed: Typically between 4 – 20 Mbps (https://www.t-mobile.com/responsibility ... et-service) (it also says for 4g tethering / hotspotting it should be Upload Speed: Typically between 3 – 17 Mbps)

Technically, this will only matter when I'm visiting and want to work remotely but I just want to be on the safe side here! I definitely need at least 3 mbps upload, otherwise there's problems.

2) Equipment recommendations - I almost hesitate to ask this because this is frequently asked! Nevertheless, considering our relatively modest goals, I'm wondering how 'strong' we need to go?

I mean on the one hand, my mother is apparently getting quite decent 4g lte download speeds on her phone, so I should expect the sort of lower tier setup like this one to be sufficient:

https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/routers/lte-rou ... fi-router/
https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/modems/quectel- ... l-ec25-af/

(as detailed in https://wirelessjoint.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2787)

But if y'all would think it safer to splurge on equipment that is compatible with 5g in order to potentially get better upload speeds (for 5g devices T mobile claims 10 - 34 upload), then well those may be considered of course. Though that equipment is just so much more expensive, so it'd be nice to get by with less if possible.

Thank you for everyone's help! All of this is a lot to take in at first but thanks to all the detailed answers I'm slowly starting to understand everything

[Didneywhorl]

Hey there! Welcome!

I think you would love the NEXR5GO router, with your modem of choice, over the NEXQ6GO.
https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/routers/wifix-r ... 8ghz-wifi/

If you want to tether your phone as the modem, you can do that. iPhone and Android supported. No modem needed.

But if you want to use a modem and have its own SIM card, and potentially be able to use outdoor high powered antennas, if needed, then I would recommend the Sierra MC7411 to drop into the NEXR5GO router.
https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/modems/sierra-w ... ced-modem/

Get those two and rock it out with the Tmobile plan. B71 and all supported, AND the MC7411 supports 2x Carrier aggregation on the uplink, which isn't real common for a category 7 level modem.

The MC7411 is a step above the EC25AF modem, without hopping up into the high category modems with 4 antennas.

[gscheb]

Yes an outdoor antenna is the only way I know of to improve that upload speed. With the sound of your goals don't need super expensive modem just quality antenna.
Have you checked to see if you qualify for T-Mobile home internet? If you did get equipment free. And cheaper monthly than magenta max.
Then can use that savings to spend on good outdoor antenna.

[blobfish]

Hello! And thank you for the welcome

If you want to tether your phone as the modem, you can do that. iPhone and Android supported. No modem needed.

Please pardon my ignorance, but without the modem, would the the T-mobile sim consider such a setup (ie phone directly connected to the router) as tethering? Or perhaps this is related to some of the stuff I've been reading, like IMEI spoofing?

Since with the Magenta Max plan there's only 40gb of 4g for hotspotting (and I assume tethering).......though really from what's been mentioned in regard to upload, it sounds like if I want decent upload speeds, we're going to need an antenna anyway! (which means getting a modem)

Sorry some more questions if that's okay!

In regard to the NEXR5GO router, it says "we strongly recommend upgrading to our top quality 12V 4A (48W) power adapter when using most CAT12/CAT16/Cat18/CAT20 modems".

The modem you suggested (Sierra MC7411) appears to be CAT-7, so is that upgraded power adapter necessary?

That said, it also says:

"When installing the WEXR5GO [sic] in an external antenna/enclosure, where it will be powered over the ethernet cable (PoE), we recommend our 24V Desktop or Wall PoE Adapter. Like most PoE routers, the Power is provided to the WAN port which must be modified to a LAN port for most cellular modem applications."

I read this as: "if we end up needing to put the router/modem outside in a weatherproof box to be closer to the antenna, we should order this adapter" - is that correct?

We probably will need an antenna for improved upload speeds, do you think the recommended ones are good? (It says a lot of people like to use this: https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/antennas/cisco- ... extension/)

Thank you SO MUCH for this help!! My mother is desperate to drop Ziply, she keeps telling me to chose equipment asap and then "overnight it"!

[blobfish]

Have you checked to see if you qualify for T-Mobile home internet? If you did get equipment free. And cheaper monthly than magenta max.

I am very regretful to say that neither T-Mobile nor Verizon home internet are options

I think we'll go with this router: https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/routers/wifix-r ... 8ghz-wifi/

There are loads of recommended antennas, though I notice they are all omni directional. From what I understand, a directional antenna is usually better for a stationary home (vs an RV or boat).

Are there any antennas in particular that you would recommend? If it'll help boost the upload to something reasonable, it'll be well worth it!

[Dr-BroadBand]

What modem are you going with?

Before you get to antennas would test with the ones that are on the router.
If needed bring your setup to the tower for testing to get a base line of speed.

Antennas are the next level of this nut you will need to crack.

Can use a Power Inverter if needed, something like below.
Look for a true sine wave.

https://www.amazon.com/KISAE-Technology ... G0NG&psc=1

[Adm1jtg]

let me chime in about the external enclosure and mounting the router outside via POE. That is certainly one way to do it and if you on a tall pole one of the better ways, however, if your just going to mount antennas on your roof and your home is a one or 2 story you could also just run some high quality cable inside and thus keep the router inside as well.

For me keeping the main router inside simplifies things greatly. I can look at the lights on it and i can add or remove ethernet devices from it easily. Also I live in georgia where during the day in the summer that outside box could easily hit over 100 degrees in the shade, not at all good for the electronics. Also we get horrible storms, yes you do lose a little bit of signal over mounting it outdoors, there are always tradeoffs but with a high quality lmr400 or even lmr200 cable and only a 20 foot run (distance in a 2 story house from the roof to the first floor) you really dont lose much.

[blobfish]

What modem are you going with?

I like the one that was recommended above, so: https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/modems/sierra-w ... ced-modem/

And holy smokes that inverter is expensive, I shouldn't be surprised though as I live on a boat and that's actually way cheap for a nautical one....

That's a great tip about going up to the tower to test speeds! Thank you!!

[blobfish]

but with a high quality lmr400 or even lmr200 cable and only a 20 foot run (distance in a 2 story house from the roof to the first floor) you really dont lose much.

That's great to know thanks!! It's only one level so hopefully we can get by with just an antenna on the roof.

[Dr-BroadBand]

And holy smokes that inverter is expensive, I shouldn't be surprised though as I live on a boat and that's actually way cheap for a nautical one....

Ya a little over kill, they also make a smaller 400W for $100.
They are designed for boats & campers.

It came in handy the week Texas froze over and we had no power for a week.
Had the Min-Van powering the house .... TV, internet, few lights

After you throw a few of the "Cheap" one's in the trash you rethink the cost of ownership.
Buy once, cry once

https://www.kisaepower.com

[blobfish]

After you throw a few of the "Cheap" one's in the trash you rethink the cost of ownership.
Buy once, cry once

100%!!! My rule is that any thing that gets high-usage (or has lots of moving parts) is definitely worth investing in. If only to spare me having to research / shop all over again every few years, it's worth it!

[blobfish]

So the router and modem are on their way, and we have the T-Mobile sim card now and the plan's activated.

Could anyone please tell us, is there anything else we need to get started?

And if someone could please confirm what we should do when the stuff arrives, I'd rrrrreally appreciate it! I've tried searching for any info / tutorials on this forum, but hm maybe my google-fu is not up to snub...?

For example, I was under the impression that I would need to use an old cellphone (with the sim card in it) to connect to the router. Though I do see that it's possible to put the sim card in a sim adapter? Is the sim card first activated in the phone...?

Sorry for the basic questions - I'm not afraid to try things out with tech but I'm just really new at all of this!!

[Adm1jtg]

Once the sim is activated you put the sim in the router and the router becomes a stand alone unit. You could even take the router with you and use it anywhere with the included whip style antennas.

As far as anything else to look into if you have setup a basic wifi router before this one is much the same, just some extra parts that deal with the modem.

Once setup and running you will need to find. the best lte band and run tons of speedstests but we can get into that once you get the equipment.

[Didneywhorl]

So the router and modem are on their way, and we have the T-Mobile sim card now and the plan's activated.

Could anyone please tell us, is there anything else we need to get started?

And if someone could please confirm what we should do when the stuff arrives, I'd rrrrreally appreciate it! I've tried searching for any info / tutorials on this forum, but hm maybe my google-fu is not up to snub...?

For example, I was under the impression that I would need to use an old cellphone (with the sim card in it) to connect to the router. Though I do see that it's possible to put the sim card in a sim adapter? Is the sim card first activated in the phone...?

Sorry for the basic questions - I'm not afraid to try things out with tech but I'm just really new at all of this!!

Looks like you went NEXR5GO and MC7411.

Remind me/us what exactly you purchased if anything else or different than above. I can guide you to the relevant info, or even help directly where there is a void of info.

[blobfish]

Once the sim is activated you put the sim in the router and the router becomes a stand alone unit. You could even take the router with you and use it anywhere with the included whip style antennas.

Oh thank you SO much for the replying!

I somehow missed this before, but I see now that the router says it'll accept a standard-sized sim card.

Though I see at that website, thewirelesshaven.com, they also sell sim card adapters, good to know haha! We got the sim card activated at the store, though I was just reading that to get netflix activated we'll need to do it through the mobile app? (or the website, but that still involves receiving a text to verify the phone....)

[blobfish]

Looks like you went NEXR5GO and MC7411.

Remind me/us what exactly you purchased if anything else or different than above. I can guide you to the relevant info, or even help directly where there is a void of info.

Thank you!! So far, just the NEXR5GO and MC7411 are on their way. We also have an activated T Mobile Magenta Max sim card ready

After testing the router/modem, I'll see how fast everything is and if an antenna is necessary

[Adm1jtg]

How are you going to use netflix ... on a computer or a device like a roku? As I dont think your thinking about this setup in the right way. the router you just bought works just like if you had comcast or att and they gave you a modem device. Once the sim for your router is activated and installed it pretty much just allows access to and from the internet.

So if you want to watch netflix, you would simply hook the device you want to watch netflix on to the wifi of your new router. Any "activation" of netflix would be on the specific device not on the router.

Does this make sense?

[gscheb]

Set up for TMobile is

APN=fast.t-mobile.com
TTL= 64

[blobfish]

How are you going to use netflix ... on a computer or a device like a roku? As I dont think your thinking about this setup in the right way. the router you just bought works just like if you had comcast or att and they gave you a modem device. Once the sim for your router is activated and installed it pretty much just allows access to and from the internet.

So if you want to watch netflix, you would simply hook the device you want to watch netflix on to the wifi of your new router. Any "activation" of netflix would be on the specific device not on the router.

Does this make sense?

Ah, so I wasn't being clear - it looks like that to activate the Netflix subscription, it'll involve either 1) putting the sim card into a phone to use the T-Mobile app or 2) logging into T-Mobile's website, which involves...putting the sim card into a phone so you can receive a verification text.

After that, my mother will definitely just use a computer to access Netflix (she is kinda technology-phobic...)

Seeing as how the router uses a standard-sized sim card (and all the phones we have accept nano, and tablets micro), I suppose we'll have to get one of those nano-to-standard sim card kits, so that we can activate Netflix using a phone, and then put the sim card in the router.

[blobfish]

Set up for TMobile is

APN=fast.t-mobile.com
TTL= 64

My hero!!!

Thank you so much, I am just so amazed at how helpful everyone is!!

[gscheb]

If you are using rooter you can send and receive text messages In there.
Go to modem then sms messaging

Screenshot_20210717-151030.png

[Adm1jtg]

Ah, so I wasn't being clear - it looks like that to activate the Netflix subscription, it'll involve either 1) putting the sim card into a phone to use the T-Mobile app or 2) logging into T-Mobile's website, which involves...putting the sim card into a phone so you can receive a verification text.

After that, my mother will definitely just use a computer to access Netflix (she is kinda technology-phobic...)

Seeing as how the router uses a standard-sized sim card (and all the phones we have accept nano, and tablets micro), I suppose we'll have to get one of those nano-to-standard sim card kits, so that we can activate Netflix using a phone, and then put the sim card in the router.

Absolutely correct about the nano to standard sim card adaptor. I am not even sure you can buy a full sized sim card anymore lol

That said if yu want to be REALLY cheap and not pay the $6 for a sim card adaptor tmobile and every other cell company these days uses a "multi sim kit" meaning the sim is a breakaway and you break out the size you need. In yur case you could break out the sim to nano size, activate your netflix and the carefully fit it back into the "full size" It works but its usually easier to buy an adaptor kit as the sim tend to fall out of the outer ring section if not extremely careful, and if you try something like taping it the tape makes it get stuck. The adaptor kits use a celephane layer to keep it. in place

[blobfish]

If you are using rooter you can send and receive text messages In there.

Amazing!! I do indeed see other posts talking about this Rooter/Goldenorb firmware, I assume that's what I'll hafta use as well

[blobfish]

That said if yu want to be REALLY cheap and not pay the $6 for a sim card adaptor tmobile and every other cell company these days uses a "multi sim kit" meaning the sim is a breakaway and you break out the size you need. In yur case you could break out the sim to nano size, activate your netflix and the carefully fit it back into the "full size"

omg I admit I did consider that

But perhaps I can use that Rooter firmware to receive texts?? All the stuff's supposed to arrive by Thursday so not tooo long to wait (regretting not upgrading the shipping, like my mother insisted )

[Didneywhorl]

If you run into any trouble, I can mock up a duplicate of your system and send you a copy of the configuration file.

Then all you need to do is make a few modem settings and you're done.

Honestly, it's better if you try to set up yourself first so that you have the experience if and when you need to troubleshoot.

[Adm1jtg]

Its really not hard at all. The basic setup is almost identical to setting up any home wifi router. You can setup things like dhcp and firewall stuff or not. Goldenorb just adds in a section for the modem, and honestly all you need to do in that section to get up and running is put in the APN.

If you dont know what dhcp and apn are dont worry many in here can help you out. With help you should be able to have a basic connection in about 10 minutes.

That said all the fun begins after that of testing speeds and lte bands and all for the best optimized config. Again not hard but if your OCD like me can take quite a bit of time, time well spent however:)

[Dr-BroadBand]

Would agree with Adm1jth, you will be up and running soon!!

The only hard part of this game is spoofing your self onto the network with an older $20, iPad SIM.
It can be done but sometimes it takes a little black magic.

A weak signal can be a little of a challenge but can be solved with a good antenna setup,

On an iPhone
Call this number to put the iPhone into field test mode.
*3001#12345#* will give you clues how good your signal is in your area.

See link for what a good number is for a signal
https://thewirelesshaven.com/cellular-signal-guide

[Adm1jtg]

If on android I use either LTE discovery, network cell info lite or cellmapper. They are all in playstore and all free. More a matter of whoch interface you find easiest to use.

[blobfish]

If you run into any trouble, I can mock up a duplicate of your system and send you a copy of the configuration file.

Then all you need to do is make a few modem settings and you're done.

Honestly, it's better if you try to set up yourself first so that you have the experience if and when you need to troubleshoot.

You're very kind, thank you!

So, this seems like a very basic question, but if you could please point me in the direction of any sort of guide for getting set up I would greatly appreciate it!

The thing is, I am a bit flummoxed as to where to even start! So for example, the modem I've ordered (due to arrive Thursday / tomorrow!!), it appears to be without a case. So, does this mean it needs to be installed within the case of the wifi router...?

And from there, I assume I download the firmware onto my computer, then connect to the new network, and configure things (possibly using trial and error)?

I had a read of your explanation of things like TTL, soooo I'm starting to get used to the lingo but I've got a ways to go!!

Btw I really like your profile pic! Reminds me of the 90s and driving out in the county and seeing some maaaassive satellite dishes...I noticed recently you don't see those anymore, at least not around here. But still, it's a nice bit of nostalgia

[blobfish]

If you dont know what dhcp and apn are dont worry many in here can help you out. With help you should be able to have a basic connection in about 10 minutes.

That said all the fun begins after that of testing speeds and lte bands and all for the best optimized config. Again not hard but if your OCD like me can take quite a bit of time, time well spent however:)

oh yes I can be a bit OCD!!! I am relieved to hear you say it can be up and running pretty quickly but I am bracing myself for the fiddling!!! But if there's high speed net this time tomorrow, my mother will be sooooo happy!!!

(and also if there's high speed net this time tomorrow - it'll be because of kind folks like yourself handholding me through all of this!! Seriously can't say enough how much I appreciate this!!)

[blobfish]

Would agree with Adm1jth, you will be up and running soon!!

The only hard part of this game is spoofing your self onto the network with an older $20, iPad SIM.
It can be done but sometimes it takes a little black magic.

A weak signal can be a little of a challenge but can be solved with a good antenna setup,

On an iPhone
Call this number to put the iPhone into field test mode.
*3001#12345#* will give you clues how good your signal is in your area.

See link for what a good number is for a signal
https://thewirelesshaven.com/cellular-signal-guide

Oh only my brother uses iPhone, I think he'll be up for the weekend but hopefully we'll have everything sorted by then anyway! Thank you very kindly for the info, the help on this forum is beyond anything!

[blobfish]

If on android I use either LTE discovery, network cell info lite or cellmapper. They are all in playstore and all free. More a matter of whoch interface you find easiest to use.

Oh how wonderful!! I did find out from a customer service person where the nearest T-Mobile tower and while only around 3 miles it's through plenty of trees...that said even in a phone data download is often over 20 mbps so here's to hoping that we can achieve respectable speeds with a proper router and modem!!

I will certainly check out those apps tomorrow too, thanks for sharing!

[Adm1jtg]

You're very kind, thank you!

So, this seems like a very basic question, but if you could please point me in the direction of any sort of guide for getting set up I would greatly appreciate it!

The thing is, I am a bit flummoxed as to where to even start! So for example, the modem I've ordered (due to arrive Thursday / tomorrow!!), it appears to be without a case. So, does this mean it needs to be installed within the case of the wifi router...?

And from there, I assume I download the firmware onto my computer, then connect to the new network, and configure things (possibly using trial and error)?

I had a read of your explanation of things like TTL, soooo I'm starting to get used to the lingo but I've got a ways to go!!

Btw I really like your profile pic! Reminds me of the 90s and driving out in the county and seeing some maaaassive satellite dishes...I noticed recently you don't see those anymore, at least not around here. But still, it's a nice bit of nostalgia

Ok I didnt see the specifics of your order but here are the basics for first steps when you get all your equipment.

You are correct the modem is a small card that will install inside your router. You simply slide it into the slot in the router, kinda like when you install a memory sim in a computer, and put one screw in to hold it in place. You then take the pigtails, the tiny gold ends of the pigtail press onto the modem card (be careful and gentle take your time till you FEEL them press on). Rotate then slightly when pushing down to make sure they feel like they are on correctly.

The other ends bolt into the holes in the case of your router. Note the case side might already be installed for you by The Wireless Haven. If your using the included internal antennas you just screw those on the appropriate place on the outside of your router, they are usually labelled, 4g, 5g and 2.4g both on the router and on the antenna itself.

If you are using external antennas you would be replacing the (2) 4g labelled antennas with the cables running from your antenna(s) on the roof.

Thats really it for hardware,

As far as software I would think that goldenorb whatever variant would come pre-installed. If not I am sure the guys in here can link you to the process for what I call. factory reset and reload as some routers come with chinese firmware, but I think you ordered all your things from The Wireless Haven so that shoudnt be an issue.

Now all you do is connect an ethernet cable from your computer to the router, any port will do. in your browser type in the correct ip address to access your router (I think its usually 192.168.1.1), login and password are usually admin and admin respectively. Once in go to the modem tab then the configuration profile and in the apn section put in the correct apn for your provider.

That should get you basic connectivity. I will be honest I forget where the ttl settings are at as its literally a set it and forget it setting and its been over a year for me. I am sure one of the more knowledgeable people in here then me can point yo to that setting.

After all that its just a matter of letting your ocd work for you, aiming the antennas while on the roof and monitoring signal and also testing which lte bands work best for you.

Its seems like kinda a lot to take in i know but as a quote from a favorite book of mine says:
DONT PANIC

We got your back and it really isnt that hard just take it step by step and realize I gave a fairly detailed description for something that in reality will take you like I said before about 10 minutes, lol probably less time then it took me to write this,

[blobfish]

Wow thank you so much for these instructions!!! Seriously blown away here, thank you!!

You are correct the modem is a small card that will install inside your router. You simply slide it into the slot in the router, kinda like when you install a memory sim in a computer, and put one screw in to hold it in place.

So haha it's just arrived, and this is my first stumbling block I'm afraid!! I can't see where the silly modem goes inside the router, I promise you I've installed ram in plenty of laptops, changed laptop screens out, even upgraded HDDs to SSD ones, which involves cloning the original drive - so I'm a total novice, I swear! (ofc I do admit all that's pretty low-level stuff, not to mention also I did all that stuff back in the day, and I've come to realize that world is a much different place when you have ample time to research and figure things out...)

This is the equipment I have:

https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/modems/sierra-w ... ced-modem/

https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/routers/wifix-r ... 8ghz-wifi/

I notice it does say this about the router: "The NEXR5GO is equipped with a single Mini PCI-E modem slot which allows modem installation without additional hardware."

Is the slot super hidden?! And I'm wondering, the picture shown below the above quote, did they just remove the router's case to show it looks like when it's installed? I don't want to remove the case unnecessarily...

Thank you again so much, can't say that enough!!!

[gscheb]

Look at this Link. Will show pictures of where it goes.

https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/routers/wifix-r ... 8ghz-wifi/

[Adm1jtg]

Short answer... yes you have to open the case. Wen you do you will see the green board like in the pic and the modem slot is the bottom right hand area. In the pic you see the modem already installed.

If you look closely at the green board pic that silver square is your modem. You can see the 2 small gold connectors on the left edge of it and the black plastic bar is where you insert the gold stripe part of the modem into. This will put it in at an angle you then press down so its flat and insert the one screw.

Dont forget you will have to press those 2 small gold connectors onto the modem card. Some think its easier to do this with the modem loose some say do it after the modem is scrwed in. Either way works,

[blobfish]

You can see the 2 small gold connectors on the left edge of it and the black plastic bar is where you insert the gold stripe part of the modem into. This will put it in at an angle you then press down so its flat and insert the one screw.

Dont forget you will have to press those 2 small gold connectors onto the modem card. Some think its easier to do this with the modem loose some say do it after the modem is scrwed in. Either way works,

I have the modem in but I am struggling with those little gold connectors!! Everyone including yourself says they can break so it's making me quite nervous to press down! I feel like the bit on the modem itself is slightly off-center, while the holes in the gold connectors are quite on-center.........

But thanks for the advice!!!

[Adm1jtg]

Line them up best you can and you can EXTREMELY gently rock them a little till you feel them push in.

I will be honest with you I bought the epo6-a modem for a few reasons but one main reason was it uses the larger gold connectors... and they are still pretty small and challenging to connect.

If you have someone hold a magnifying glass or a camera on zoom mode when you try to connect them it might be a little easier with that zoomed in look at it. You can also look at the pins in the modems connector to see if your suspicions are correct in that the pins arent 100% straight.

[blobfish]

GOT IT!!! oh that was a doozy but it's all closed up now!! There were quite satisfying clicks, phew!!

...tho haha reading what you just wrote, I probably should've inspected everything one last time but I was just so relieved!

oh this is a bit vexing however, while the external antennas are labelled I don't see labels on the actual router itself! On closer inspection of the picture from the website (https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/routers/wifix-r ... 8ghz-wifi/), it looks like the forward left one is 4g at least....?

They only have a firmware tutorial at the moment, with a promise to "soon" have instructions for how to install the modem and all that jazz hmm I wonder if it's pretty standard which side they go on...?

[Adm1jtg]

You can cheat.... the (2) 4g antennas are the ones that run from the modem on those wonderful pigtails you just installed, Looking at the pic from above again the green board one that would seem to be your front left and front right ones.

Sometimes the antennas are "keyed" differently aka the antennas will only fit on the correct terminal. If not see above for where to put the 4g ones

[blobfish]

Sometimes the antennas are "keyed" differently aka the antennas will only fit on the correct terminal. If not see above for where to put the 4g ones

woahhhh I think it's working now?! (and also I have an extra antenna that won't fit into the correct terminal, they're both male I guess?!)

Speed tests have been running at 20 - 30 mbps!!! Incredible!! So the download is all fixed then!!

I think I still have some tinkering to do! For example, the upload still seems to hover around .5mbps, soooooo maybe I will need an external / roof antenna after all! But that's just for me when I'm here (and ahem I *should* visit more often but y'know, life?! I'm gonna be here for awhile longer - I can stay longer if the upload speeds increase but really my two brothers and I are trying to visit as much as possible, as our father died a couple years ago and after around 45 years of marriage our mother is quite open about the fact that she doesn't want to be alone, and just wants to gather us around her ).

Any suggestions for antennas and how to get upload speeds increased will be most gratefully received! Meanwhile, my mother is officially over the moon now!! Thank you to everyone for helping us get here!!!

[Adm1jtg]

before yu go to antennas try changing lte bands and also post numbers from your modem/netwirk status page.
Specifically
signal strength %
rssi
ecio
rscp
lte band

Also be aware those numbers can change drastically based on which lte band your commected to. Lte band is also shown on that page under... you guessed it .... lte band

Time of day can also make a huge difference in speeds as well as weather.

Told you this would be fun for someone with OCD

As far as your next question.... well how do i change the lte bands?
You type in a specific AT command line in the At command area of the modem misc area on the router
I will leave the specifics of the commands to one of the mods in here as the commands can vary by modem.

So this means the following to do a COMPLETE analysis of your system BEFORE I would look into external antennas you would need to do multiple tests at various times of the day on different lte bands.

[blobfish]

before yu go to antennas try changing lte bands and also post numbers from your modem/netwirk status page.
Specifically
signal strength %
rssi
ecio
rscp
lte band

I will definitely have a good fiddle with this tomorrow!! Don't worry my OCD will get its fill with this

Ya know I thought I'd have some good news about the upload speed - for about an hour, the upload speeds were magnificent (8-10+). I thought maybe it just needed some time to settle in but haha, nope! Down to 1.xx again now.......though download speed's up to 48mbps!!

I should turn in for bed right now, but I'm still amazed it's finally happened! Seriously can't thank you guys enough, my mother was so thrilled and has stars in her eyes and is wanting me to show her how to watch Netflix on her tablet tomorrow (and download stuff for when she goes to California to visit family and can watch on the plane haha...I can already tell she'll be on a new 'tech binge', she wants now a new case for her tablet and bluetooth headset like I have and wants me to order her the stuff first thing tomorrow ).

Oh and I wanted to mention to anyone this might benefit: I thought the Magenta Max plan would be $85 per month, but they have a discount for those age 55+, and a $5 discount if you get autopay, so for my mother's plan ended up being only $65 per month! (also includes an $8/9 credit or whatever's enough to cover the basic Netflix plan, and if you want multiple simultaneous screens you can get the credit instead to lower the monthly fee)

To say my mother is thrilled that she's no longer on such wheezing slow internet would be an understatement! So I can't say thank you enough! She's been aching to drop Ziply because they always give her or my brother the runaround, and now she can

[blobfish]

before yu go to antennas try changing lte bands and also post numbers from your modem/netwirk status page.
Specifically
signal strength %
rssi
ecio
rscp
lte band

So here is that info:

Signal Strength :38%
RSSI :-89 dBm
ECIO3G/RSRQ4G/SS_RSRQ5G : -11.2 dB
RSCP3G/RSRP4G/SS_RSRP5G : -113 dBm
Band : B2 (Bandwidth 5 MHz)

Speed tests in the past hour have led to very different upload speeds, mostly between 1-2mbps but occasionally 2-8.

If I could 95% of the time guarantee 3 upload that would be a huge win!

So from here, it sounds like it'll just be very patient trial and error at different bands to see if that upload speed is possible? err just out of curiosity how many bands are there..?

[Dr-BroadBand]

USA 4G See Chart

[Dr-BroadBand]

Signal Numbers.png

Your lack of speed is due to poor signal numbers.

Your RSSI is OFF the chart

Short term fix is doing a road trip with your setup, go to the tower.
Long term get and antenna .... antennas Qty-2

The #1 trick to this game is location... location...LOCATION!!

https://thewirelesshaven.com/cellular-signal-guide/

[Didneywhorl]

The label on the bottom of the router shows the exact location for each antenna.

[blobfish]

Short term fix is doing a road trip with your setup, go to the tower.

I can see the router's a 12v system, and my brother should have the necessary adapter to plug this into a car (as he has a van for all his climbing excursions, you know the type!). He should be coming up this weekend so I can hopefully have an investigate.

[Dr-BroadBand]

Sure.

This is what I use for road trips to keep my family blanketed in WiFi.
My son was able to do ZOOM School at 75mph, wife placed a grocery order for curb pick up!

https://www.amazon.com/UpBright-Fidelit ... 672&sr=8-2

[Adm1jtg]

An even easier first step.... try putting your router near a window or in different locations inside the house. Then get an extension cord and see what type of signals you get outside.

Also your using band 2 which looks to be only 5mhz. Changng to another available band like 4 or 66 will usually bring your bandwidth to 10 or sometimes even 20.

Also different bands have different abilty to do things like penetrate trees and some are more congested then others....

Starting to see the OCD aspect

and just for the record my current settings arent drastically different then yours:
Signal Strength :41% currently and can even hit mid 30s
RSSI :-87 dBm
ECIO :-9 (RSRQ) dB
RSCP :-113(RSRP) dbm

I am using band 66 which is 20mhz and caa (we can get into what caa is later) of a second channel on band 66 or band 13 for an additional 10mhz

I can pretty regularily get 20-30 down in the mornings (evenings are always worse for me) and i would say 2-5 up. Now mind you this is WITH antennas and all in place as I live in a heavily forested area with major mountains all around and my closest line of sight tower is around 7 miles away. , So if I can do it you certainly can

One last note if your doing speed tests to check speed as we all do note that you always need to yse the same server. It will try to find the best optimal server, pick on and use that one for all tests, as the results can vary pretty wildly from server to server.

[blobfish]

The label on the bottom of the router shows the exact location for each antenna.

crumbs how embarrassing! I swear I had a look there, but golly...

aaaanyway, so, here's what it looks like:

....well apparently I need to upload photos to another website to share them here, but ahem this is basically what it looks like:

1. cellular 2. cellular
3. 5g
4. 2.4g 5. 2.4g


Okay after some experimenting need to edit what I just posted, so with that in mind:

Originally, I had the 5.8g antenna in one of the cellular slots (due to the picture on the The Wireless Haven website). I assumed 'cellular' meant 4g, so after noticing that diagram a few hours ago, I tried to switch the 5.8g antenna for a 4g one, but it doesn't connect properly. So I have (for the two forward antennas), one's 4.0g and the other's 5.8g.

There's also another antenna point, but nothing I have will screw into properly!


Also, random question, but the instructions that came with router state that when changing the router's settings, the router should never be connected to wifi. So this includes changing the band right? I have to power it down and remove the sim card each time??

[Adm1jtg]

As far as antennas and what to hook where if you arent sure crack the router box open again and like i said follow the wires. those 2 gold connectors youhad so much fun with run from the modem to connectors on the router box. Thats where you want to hook your 4g antennas to.

As far as changing bands I always do it over wifi but after you type in the at command to change it and it says ok you will likely need to then do a system/reboot as mine will take then drop connection till i reboot but like i said the reboot can be done from inside the router setup and over wifi as well

[blobfish]

As far as antennas and what to hook where if you arent sure crack the router box open again and like i said follow the wires. those 2 gold connectors youhad so much fun with run from the modem to connectors on the router box. Thats where you want to hook your 4g antennas to.

As far as changing bands I always do it over wifi but after you type in the at command to change it and it says ok you will likely need to then do a system/reboot as mine will take then drop connection till i reboot but like i said the reboot can be done from inside the router setup and over wifi as well

Cool, thanks! I opened her up and indeed what I'm calling the top two (left and right) antenna hooks are in fact connected to the gold connectors/modem.

But!! Only one 4g antenna will connect, the other has the wrong sort of connector (and doesn't stay upright anyway...)

Surely this can't be right...? I can put the 5.8g antenna into the 4g antenna hook, in fact I think I have to because I don't get net when I don't

And as for the commands to change the band for the Sierra MC7411 modem that I've got, does this have the proper info I need?

https://wirelessjoint.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=364

Or should I contact the manufacturer? I read the warning about how improper use of at commands can brick the modem (!!) and crumbs I am anxious!

[Adm1jtg]

I have a different modem then you but that appears to be the correct spreadsheet.

As far as bricking your modem with the wrong command..... yes and no
You COULD POSSIBLY soft brick it meaning the router woukd no longer be able to send commands to it but even in that case all you would have to do is buy a usb adaptor and issue commands to it through the usb port of your desktop/laptop machine to get it all running again. Inconvenient and a huge pain for sure but not bricked in the truest sense as it can be recovered.

That said I have NEVER even soft bricked my modem by issuesing AT commands to it to change lte bands. So how do I know then... Well I issued other AT commands improperly and softbricked mine early on and thats how I am so familiar with the recovery procedure.

If you issue a bad AT command to try and change the lte band it just wont accept it. Then you simply try again till you get the syntax right.

Said one last way, doing what your doing its damn near impossible to really do any damage to your equipment.

[blobfish]

As far as bricking your modem with the wrong command..... yes and no
You COULD POSSIBLY soft brick it meaning the router woukd no longer be able to send commands to it but even in that case all you would have to do is buy a usb adaptor and issue commands to it through the usb port of your desktop/laptop machine to get it all running again. Inconvenient and a huge pain for sure but not bricked in the truest sense as it can be recovered.

Well I will have to check and recheck before trying, but at least I can't do too much damage - thanks for the reassurance!


Oh and an update for the field trip - we went up to the tower as close as we could go...which was still a fair ways beneath the tower with plenty of trees blocking (it's a fast twisty highway it was off of, and weren't sure if there was a service road or someone's driveway we would've been driving up...)

Download speeds easily 60, not too different from here really as it's not uncommon for it to be 40-50+. But for the several minutes we sat there, the upload was always between 13-16. When we were almost back (on some open road, very clear area without hills or trees), the upload speed jumped up to 22mbps!

We went up to the roof with an extension cable, and yeah download speeds between 40-50 (which again is not too for even unusual inside), and uploads were always around 13-15mpbs. Granted, only stayed up there 10-15m, and this was all in clear weather (and tests done only in the evening).

We definitely spotted a tower from the roof that we think is the T-Mobile tower we drove near to / saw up on the big hill, though it feels a bit too far north but after driving along the twisty highway maybe?

Since getting back upload speeds have been always between 0.07 - 1.5.

Tomorrow I'll try putting the router in the room just south of the office - outside of both rooms, it's directly trees and beyond that (through more trees and hills) is the tower. Might try going up on the roof too at different times to see how upload speeds are then too

Thank you again very very much for everyone's assistance! I feel like it's so close! Almost got workable (hopefully reliable) internet

[Dr-BroadBand]

For your testing would remove the WiFi Radio from the equation. To simplify things. By Turning off Wi-Fi.

WiFi is sexy but is Half duplex, half the speed of copper.

Also take good notes, log what your Signal strength is, Single quality, single to noise ratio.
Time of day, what day, weather conditions, blah blah …..

Note speed test uses large amount of data.
Also can vary quite a lot, depending which server you get connected to. Also time a day, the amount of traffic on the network. Just like the roads.

Better off using signal strength as a metrics.

You are about to enter the fine tuning phase.
Antennas setup is an art form

Congratulations you’re on your way

[blobfish]

Note speed test uses large amount of data.
Also can vary quite a lot, depending which server you get connected to. Also time a day, the amount of traffic on the network. Just like the roads.

Better off using signal strength as a metrics.

You are about to enter the fine tuning phase.
Antennas setup is an art form

Congratulations you’re on your way

Oh crumbs I've been doing zillions of speed tests!! :O I'd better check what T-Mobile's fair usage policy is for their unlimited 4g

Also, very hopeful signs after moving the router into the room south of this one! The T-Mobile tower is to the NE of us, but the SE room (as opposed to the NE room) gets better reception! (Perhaps a gap in the trees outside?)

I've been running tests periodically throughout the day, and the upload speeds haven't dropped below about 2.5, but often it's 3-4.5. Just now put it in the window of the room in case the blackout curtains are blocking, and the upload's 6.00! There are just some occasional plunges to 0.07 mbps, otherwise quite steady numbers.

(download seems to be more often 30-60+, vs 20-50, like in the NE room/office)

These are the latest numbers:

Network : LTE
CSQ :17
Signal Strength :54%
RSSI :-79 dBm
ECIO3G/RSRQ4G/SS_RSRQ5G :-14.6 dB
RSCP3G/RSRP4G/SS_RSRP5G :-107 dBm
SINR :-
Connection Monitoring Status : Disabled


So definitely some improvement, with some metrics in the 'fair' category now!!

Now I do expect with some clouds and wind, it'll plunge again. We are in the longest drought since something like 1896 but I'm sure come fall the signal / upload etc will be a lot more variable.

I probably will always have to accept a certain amount of risk with LTE net (in terms of just expecting my upload speeds to plunge and cause me a heart attack lol).

Nevertheless, is it reasonable to hope that if I got an antenna and perhaps changed the band I might increase my upload speeds to regularly say 10-15mbps, so that even plunging 10 points I might still be 'safe'?? I mean literally a minute up the road (due east) in a moving car is what I got 22 upload yesterday...

This is all probably impossible to predict but just curious what y'all would do!

And seriously thank you to everyone so much!! Even if LTE wifi's not terribly reliable, it's still better than all other options out here!!

[Adm1jtg]

what does your ecio number look like where you get the 10-15 upload speeds
Again drawing on my own person expierence I had a situtation where i could get a stronger signal OR a cleaner signal (ecio is how clean the signal is) and what I found was the "stronger" signal which was roughly 80% but with an ecio of like 14 to 16 yielded far less reliable results then a signal strength of only 38% - 51% with an ecio always in the single digits.

This is why I was telling you that you really need to test all the above numbers on different lte bands.

Again in my own personal case band 66 was much weaker and cleaner but also had better bandwidth (20mhz) and band 13 had much much stronger signal but was not as clean and only 10 mhz bandwidth.

Also again in my personal case the router would frequently pick band 5 and occasionally band 2, neither of which was the strongest or the cleanest.

So I settled upon locking the router to ONLY use band 66 and band 13. It just so happens that my modem will caa to a second channel on band 66 or a second channel of band 13. I have seen it use both options at times and this is the best working setup for me.

I am not giving details to say do this in your situtation, but so you can kinda understand the process needed to find your best config.

For heavy tree areas like mine and yours in GENERAL it would seem the lower frequencies tend to penetrate trees much better however the higher frequency bands tend to end up having much better bandwidth and this is helpful on towers where congestion can be an issue, and congestion is always always an issue at least at times. I live in an area that hos more cows then people and congestion is still somewhat of an issue on the tower I use.

Cheat Sheet:
typical lower frequency bands: 5,12,13,17 and 71 (going from memory)
typical higher frequency bands: 4 and 66

[blobfish]

For heavy tree areas like mine and yours in GENERAL it would seem the lower frequencies tend to penetrate trees much better however the higher frequency bands tend to end up having much better bandwidth and this is helpful on towers where congestion can be an issue, and congestion is always always an issue at least at times. I live in an area that hos more cows then people and congestion is still somewhat of an issue on the tower I use.

Cheat Sheet:
typical lower frequency bands: 5,12,13,17 and 71 (going from memory)
typical higher frequency bands: 4 and 66

oh soooo much good info, thanks so much!!

I meant to do more research about bands (and the changing thereof today) but erm...went hiking instead?

I think I noted this morning that for around 6-7 upload, the ecio was in the 'fair' category? If a different band can get it higher, then of course that will be my next goal! Thank you for pointing me in the correct direction

[blobfish]

Also your using band 2 which looks to be only 5mhz. Changng to another available band like 4 or 66 will usually bring your bandwidth to 10 or sometimes even 20.

Also different bands have different abilty to do things like penetrate trees and some are more congested then others....

So maybe this is weird or maybe this happens all the time! But I noticed that for my band, it now says this:

Band :B2 (Bandwidth 20 MHz)


I have been doing speed tests at different times of the day and recording the stats like signal strength / eios etc, but not the band or bandwidth. But, I just wanted to mention that the bandwidth appears to say now it's 20 MHz instead of 5 (for some reason?!). Not sure when that happened, but perhaps when the router was moved into the SE room and had the increase in the performance??

Sooooo I would like to try changing bands (hopefully without accidentally softbricking the modem!). You suggested 66, and it's on this table as also working with T-Mobile (https://wirelessjoint.com/download/file.php? ... &mode=view).

I downloaded the spreadsheet from here: https://wirelessjoint.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=364

I input '66', and got this:

CREATE INDIVIDUAL BANDS - AT COMMAND
AT!BAND=0C,"B66",0,0,2

SET BAND - AT COMMAND
AT!BAND=0C


Which line would I want to input to the AT-command terminal when I'm logged into the modem? I assume 'set band' means locking it to the new band, whereas the perhaps the first option is simply adding another band your router might access?

And, do I need to confirm that any of these potential new bands will work with my router? I assume at least so long as I stick with the 4g bands from that previously linked table, they'll all be compatible with my 4g router? (oh and so long as they work for T-Mobile as well!)

[Dr-BroadBand]

blobfish,

You may have connected to a different tower.
Would add tower "ID" to the list of things to track.

Or they just updated your tower??

[Adm1jtg]

I would agree with Dr-Broadband you are likely on a different tower now as bands just dont change like that.

As for commands I have a quectel modem so the commands and command syntax are completely different. So I am afraid i wont be much help in specific commands.

As far as tower id you can get that from the router modem page OR you can use one of the android programs I listed and walk around the house with your phone. On cellmapper the tower id is called eNB and shows up in your dropdown when you run cell mapper. Dont forget to turn it off when your done or wil drain your battery in no time.

I used cellmapper app in this instance specifically as there is also a cell mapper website where you can take the eNB your phone lists and find out where that specific tower is on a map. Just be aware in very rural areas like mine sometimes that map information is not so accurate but its still a good start for at least a cardinal direction to aim at.

[LoveMeSomeCALTE]

Might be dependent on area but in the CA desert, using the T-mobile Magenta Max plan in a modem is resulting in 0.6Mbps symmetric, throttled and depriortized connection

My AT&T iPAD plan has been rock solid and as advertised. I don't abuse it and download TBs of data.

On the other hand, I have 2 separate T-mobile SIMs and T-mobile has been aggressively throttling. This is a complete 180 from what they used to do for years ago before they acquired Sprint where AT&T was my backup and T-mobile was my primary.

I am starting to look into Cricket to increase my AT&T exposure because of this.

I would be interested to hear where you land so feedback and datapoints would be appreciated.

[Dr-BroadBand]

See attachment

https://youtu.be/Ny_BjGfVboU

[blobfish]

I would agree with Dr-Broadband you are likely on a different tower now as bands just dont change like that.

Last week there was a rainy / cloudy day, I expected to have rubbish signal, but no! Best ever I saw. Especially in regard to upload speed (27mbps) and signal strength jumped to over 80%. I was trying to discreetly check while in an online meeting and I believe it said band 66?

But there is a new twist in this long (...LONG...) saga! Ziply the internet provider abruptly contacted us a week ago and said they'll upgrade the speed, and in fact did so last Wednesday. (We hadn't yet cancelled, as I figured my brother would want the honors, considering)

After months of back and forth, my brother had filed an FCC complaint last April against Ziply, but he'd said that nothing would come of that. That being an individual consumer, they seemed focused on just "mediating" the dispute instead of pressuring Ziply to do what a tech had told my brother they could do quite easily to increase speeds.

And perhaps this is unrelated and Ziply just suddenly remembered about my mother, but one of the techs on Wednesday, I couldn't help but overhear him say on the phone (to at least two different people), "This was approved by my regional manager......do you want me to get her on the phone? ....yeah, regional manager-approved blah blah blah"

Plugged into an ethernet cable, the speeds are now 70+ / 4 - 8 mbps for down / up. Astonishingly to me, I have already experienced dips in the upload to .07/.08 (and lost connection!). Since this is cable net I just expected it to be steadier. However, I frankly am not around all that often so this is certainly more than sufficient for my mother.

Honestly, if it were me, I think I'd rather have the T-Mobile internet. My brother says since the landline and net are bundled together, might as well just stick with Ziply. (I don't understand why my mother still has a landline but that's another issue for another day!)

The thing is, what do I do now with the router and modem for the T-Mobile setup?? I mean it's all good to go, I suppose I could sell it...?

Not gonna lie, after so much research and effort (not to mention all the help from here!!!) Ziply suddenly coming through............did not make me a happy camper. That said, I learned a LOT that's helping me improve my own internet situation, so silver lining I guess!

[blobfish]

Might be dependent on area but in the CA desert, using the T-mobile Magenta Max plan in a modem is resulting in 0.6Mbps symmetric, throttled and depriortized connection

Oh crumbs I'm no expert but from what I read, usually that sort of throttling is when the router isn't spoofed / configured properly? So that the sim can tell that it's in a router and not a phone (due to the lack of IMEI number)?

You probably already know all this, sorry! But yeah, for our location (rural WA state) there was no throttling. Everything was actually pretty steady and reliable, especially download speeds. Hilly terrain and trees, so a pretty good experience, actually.

[Tuna8er]

Go to system and generate a backup file of your settings. You should do this everytime you make changes, unless you want to reprogram again.

Try going to the Modem section of the firmwares menu after you log into the router.
Go to Custom Profile, advance settings,
Set the APN. Set the default, you should also make/add a custom profile, more precise settings.
Set the first detect part to ICCC, I think those are the right letters. Be sure to do this in the first part not second, just like a phone would. Enter the serial number on the SIM Card.
Then on the second detect the modem IMEI put the modems IMEI. Will broadcast that.
Set the DNS's
You can use 8.8.8.8 or 8.8.4.4(google)
1.1.1.1 or 1.0.0.1 (cloud flare)
4.2.2.2 (Tier 1, works best for me)
If you have a VPN they probably have a DNS also but it may slow your downloads down.
You can use all those DNS alot. Cloud flare is fast, but high packet loss, great for streaming, not good for gaming. Google is very reliable, and has decent security. Tier 1 is decent, but gets congested at times, mofi uses this one and google.
Yes for network logging and no load balancing, no AT commands at log in (unless you use that)
If you google tmobile band use you can easily pinpoint your best band of the 3. Band locking works better for me than Carrier Aggregation. Do it with the AT Commands in the modem section, miscellaneous.
Next go to the wireless section, interface. Find the LAN, go to edit. Enter the DNS you used for your modem. You can also set any Imei you want here, you can generate one from you phone (android only to use) or use the one from the modem for broadcasting back to the carrier. I use the default from the cheap burn phone I used to activate the SIM and is registered on the account usually. A phones modem broadcasts it's IMEI, but so does the phone. This part of setup broadcast the Modem that you bought IMEI and the LAN appears as phone (I suspect, not 100% sure there but works).
Nowdays they don't really deactivate the SIM any more, the may suspend it until the next days carrier update. But, I have changed settings, been detected then worked again the next day. I use Visible now, but used to use metro, which is partnered with tmobile.