Rural Internet For Dummies - MOFI4500 + TMobile?

[Swamp_Yankee]

It seems like there are a lot of threads like this popping up lately but the two others I read through seem to be started by folks who know a lot more about this stuff than me. I am just getting into this stuff and trying to understand it all. My wife and I will both be working from home in some fashion starting this school year because our children will not be able to go back to school due to COVID-19. We are in a very rural area and live 1/4 mile from the public road. Comcast quoted us $8,000 to run cable to our house which is a non-starter. Otherwise our only option is DSL which offers a maximum of 10mbps. I've been told that some people in our area utilize TMobile for internet access via a 4G/5G Router (such as a MOFI4500) and an unlimited data plan through TMobile. I went on cellmapper.net and I am 2.15 miles from a TMobile tower which carries Band 71 which I am told allows for the highest speeds. The tower is on a mountaintop about 950' elevation. We are at about 750' elevation-we don't have line of site to the tower, but that is only due to trees. Again, according to cellmapper signal is in the -80dBm range. Based on this information, first, does it seem as though it is realistic for us to simultaneously work from home, (utilizing Zoom/Google classroom for videochats) and also stream HD content through an Amazon Firestick, etc... Second, what kind of data plan would I need to select?

[MattB29]

Content deleted.

[gscheb]

We are doing those things with T-Mobile and are 4.3 miles from Tower with trees.
Would avoid the Mofi road if you haven't bought one already.
Most modems don't have band 71 but that is ok it is not going to be your fastest band. When people saying that they are probably talking about 5G stuff.
It can be done but will become a new hobby basically.

T-Mobile Setup for 55+ people
https://wirelessjoint.com/viewtopic.php?f=32 ... =140#p7409

If you are not 55+ reseller might be cheaper maybe
https://traveldata.page/

[Swamp_Yankee]

You could try and see if T-Mob's rural home internet is available to you. https://www.t-mobile.com/isp although I don't think it would provide all you want. Although your DSL is at 10mb it might be the only workable option for such high data demands of work and schooling. Trying to accomplish all that you mention including HD content is pushing it even with a cable setup. Over the cell phone network I just don't think will happen. You have to be realistic.

This guy is using external antennas (which I'm willing to and capable of doing) and getting 30-50mbps-that is more than adequate for our needs. Right now we are doing all of the above on 10mbps DSL, but usually something suffers (latency/lag in streaming video, slow downloads, etc...).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FF0j1M_WNV4

[gscheb]

Yes it is possible for sure. Allot of us doing it. If you are concerned invite over friend with T-Mobile phone and test out there speeds at your house. Being two miles away might not even need outdoor antennas. Specially if you have two story home with window facing tower direction.

[Swamp_Yankee]

I definitely seem to have options. I have an AT&T phone through work and a Verizon phone for personal use. I downloaded Network Cell Info Lite on both and did some testing. AT&T wasn't doing all that great around 6:00 p.m. as I was getting 10mbps down/1.5mbps up max with a -98 dB signal. However, I tried it again after 9:00 p.m. and got in excess of 30mbps up. Could that be due to congestion on that particular tower? If so AT&T might not be a great option because I don't want my connection to get too slow at certain points during the day. I'm off today so I'll test at various points. I just tried Verizon now (a little after 7:00 a.m.) and got a -96 dB signal and nearly 40mbps down. I'll if I can find someone with TMobile to come over and test. Am I correct in assuming that whatever signal/speeds I am getting with my phone that I will definitely get better with an external antenna? I have a two story house with a high peaked roof and a large chimney sticking out of the top. Currently there is an old disused satellite dish mount affixed to the chimney that would make a great mounting point for an antenna mast pointed directly at the tower. If I put the antenna at the top of a 10' mast it would be a little over 40' above ground level. We are at about 750' elevation and I believe that the tower base is about 100' higher in elevation than we are-not sure of the height of the tower. When it comes to antennas however I am kind of lost as there are so many different kinds. It seems that you pay a premium for the small plastic looking ones like you would see on a cell tower or the side of a building, water tower, etc...whereas the large yagi antennas are cheaper-I'm assuming because they are larger and more obtrusive. We live out in the woods (which is why we're doing this in the first place) and I don't care about the looks. Would those be a better option?

[gscheb]

Yes sounds like congestion/de-prioritization.
Yes external antennas get better signal than a phone. (your phone signals are not terrible by all means)
Then with antennas on your router / modem could be even better.
Best in my opinion to have wide band antennas. Wide band antennas just means they have the ability to get al different kinds of signals / bands.
Those Yagi Type are usually tuned to just one signal frequency.
At first I wouldn't even go with outdoor antenna take it one step at a time.
Also wouldn't recommend the Mofi if you haven't bought one already.

Here is a signal range you should be shooting for.

Signal Metrics.PNG

[Swamp_Yankee]

Thanks for those suggestions. I've actually settled on the following-I have AT&T FirstNet for work, so I have gotten authorization from my agency to utilize a Nighthawk Hotspot for work purposes:

https://www.firstnet.com/devices/invehi ... outer.html

The civilian versions of these are subject to data caps and throttling but the agency issued hotspots are not. The hotspot primarily uses Band 14 but it can do carrier aggregation so I would need a wideband antenna to fully take advantage of that, correct? It has two TS-9 connectors so I can attach two wideband antennas. I have two different towers in my area about 2-3 miles away but do not have line of sight to any of them and there are trees in all directions. I should be able to mount the antenna about 40' above ground level. Any suggestion on a type of antenna? Should I get a matching pair of antennas or two different types? My agency will reimbursement up to $500 for antennas, cabling and associated equipment. I'm hoping to get the maximum amount of performance that I need out of this network and put my wife/kids on the DSL network as 10mbps will be plenty for what they are doing.

[Didneywhorl]

Thanks for those suggestions. I've actually settled on the following-I have AT&T FirstNet for work, so I have gotten authorization from my agency to utilize a Nighthawk Hotspot for work purposes:

https://www.firstnet.com/devices/invehi ... outer.html

The civilian versions of these are subject to data caps and throttling but the agency issued hotspots are not. The hotspot primarily uses Band 14 but it can do carrier aggregation so I would need a wide band antenna to fully take advantage of that, correct? It has two TS-9 connectors so I can attach two wide band antennas. I have two different towers in my area about 2-3 miles away but do not have line of sight to any of them and there are trees in all directions. I should be able to mount the antenna about 40' above ground level. Any suggestion on a type of antenna? Should I get a matching pair of antennas or two different types? My agency will reimbursement up to $500 for antennas, cabling and associated equipment. I'm hoping to get the maximum amount of performance that I need out of this network and put my wife/kids on the DSL network as 10mbps will be plenty for what they are doing.

The Nighthawk has 4x4 mimo antennas internally. If you are only a few miles away from your towers I think using the external antenna ports to wire in 2 antennas with 40+ feet of antenna cabling will be expensive and get you not far, maybe.

Once you plug in a single external port on that router it disables all 4 internal antennas. You'll go from 4x4 mimo to 1xantenna or 2x2 mimo. Then add to that the cost of the external antennas and LMR400 cables (I dont recommend going over 20' with LMR200 cables) plus dealing with the crappy TS9 connectors, bleh.

If you need better signal and think going higher will help, try plugging your Nighthawk into an extension cord and lifting the router itself way up there and see what signal levels you get. If it gets great signal up there, then you can power it via poe and mount it inside a weatherproof enclosure and mount that puppy up on a pole instead of the antennas. Poe comes from a 12v poe splitter like https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/poe-splitters/4 ... -splitter/
and a poe injector for power like : https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/power-adapter/p ... -1-5a-72w/

[heyjb]

What would you recommend besides the Mofi?

[Didneywhorl]

What would you recommend besides the Mofi?

I replied to your other post.

[Adm1jtg]

Yes sounds like congestion/de-prioritization.
Yes external antennas get better signal than a phone. (your phone signals are not terrible by all means)
Then with antennas on your router / modem could be even better.
Best in my opinion to have wide band antennas. Wide band antennas just means they have the ability to get al different kinds of signals / bands.
Those Yagi Type are usually tuned to just one signal frequency.
At first I wouldn't even go with outdoor antenna take it one step at a time.
Also wouldn't recommend the Mofi if you haven't bought one already.

Here is a signal range you should be shooting for.

Signal Metrics.PNG

Are you sure the values in that chart are correct? The one I found and have been using is very different.
https://wiki.teltonika-networks.com/vie ... mendations
scroll down to the 4g/lte section for a chart like yours but with very different values.

As long as I am asking even on my chart I have an issue. It says RSRP > 100 means no signal yet many times when I am on band 4 or band 66 my RSRP is -112 all the way to -118 and i still stream shows reasonably well? I have found yet other sources that says RSRP actually goes to -140 and -120 to -140 is the poor category.

Is there a chart we can all use that is actually accurate?

[gscheb]

Been using that one from The Wireless Haven for a long time. For me always found it to be right. After about -118 signal so bad can't do much at all. You do not want signals lower than that. Don't ignore the quality either. So what you got going on? Struggling with something?

[Adm1jtg]

Well for example my rsrq is never better then -12 and usually -13 to -15
my sinr based on the at command is 12-13
and like i said earlier my rsrp is anywhere from -112 to -116 (depending on lte band)
My concern is this... my system is working great, but if I used that chart as a guide I would be like man I have TERRIBLE signal strength and mediocre at best quality and would be horribly discouraged. 2 out of three factors in the absolute lowest category.

I very consistently get 10-25 down and around 3-5 up. To me this is not POOR like the charts say, this is actually all I need and I would guess all most need at a minimum, especially in areas like mine that are horriffic terrain wise.

I am just worried that that chart will discourage alot of people unnessessarily or worse cause them to over buy.

[gscheb]

Those speeds you are posted can be had with poor signals. This is correct. Used to get like 45 down with -114.

Need those charts to help you tune in your outdoor antennas if you have them. And to understand if you have signal issues. They are very helpful. With out them just shooting into the dark.

[Didneywhorl]

The Wireless Haven and others have used the same guidelines for a while.
https://thewirelesshaven.com/cellular-signal-guide/

Honestly I don't know which are "correct" but my guess is it's not as simple as X stat means bad or good, but a combination that is above a simple chart to explain.

I think the guides just allow you to see where you are and where you could be, but I agree it can be misleading for some if not "taken with a grain of salt".