Mofi 4500 and existing T-mobile hotspot SIM?

[dc608]

I've lived with lousy internet long enough. Verizon DSL is the best I can do where I live. To augment that, the local library rents a hotspot to us, t-mobile "unlimited." I have no idea what the actual deal is, since I rent it from them. But it's the best internet source in our house. It only covers one room, though, so we're always carrying it to where the need is greatest.

I'm beginning my researches, and am so happy to have found this site! I'm tending in the direction of the Mofi 4500, either the SIM4 or the SIM7 version. I'm not THAT far from the tower. About 2 miles. And I sit on top of a hill, so I think I have a decent situation to put up an antenna. I actually think I may be able to pull a decent signal from t-mobile with just the better antennae on the Mofi unit...but only time and actually buying the thing will tell.

Before I go and throw money at this, I'm looking for any advice that others may have. My uneducated plan A is to buy one of the devices listed above and pull the SIM from the library's hotspot and see if that SIM will work. Does this plan have any chance of success? Since I have done nothing yet, I could completely revise this plan based on the input of clever and experienced people. So, please, tell me what my best options are. I can provide additional details as needed.

[Didneywhorl]

If you get good T-mobile service, I would go with the Calyx Institute deal. You get a Mifi8000 and an entire year of truly unlimited internet for $600. You can test it out for $175, that pays for 3 months. It is technically a donation, and the internet service is a donation reward level.

Hopefully you also have great Sprint service nearby, but the device will pickup Tmobile signals for people. It's no guarantee, but it is a great service I've used for over 2 years on Sprint towers. I do have a friend that verified his unit picked up T mobile towers as well.

You can always get a real deal home router later. The hotspot device is basically free.

Note, the MOFI is not worth the money.

[dc608]

Sadly, Sprint signal is nil here. I couldn't gamble $600 on a solution that depends on Sprint, and that seems to be their only carrier. Is there a merger coming? Because I could look into it if it becomes a t-mobile thing.

Actually, the t-mobile signal is borderline here, but I am pretty confident I can bring it up to acceptable with an external antenna. My BEST signal here at the house comes from Verizon and AT&T. I was hoping to use a device, either the Mofi or other, that had better antennae and just test my setup with the t-mobile SIM that I have in my possession, and then look for a permanent solution with Verizon or AT&T. If you don't like the Mofi, what devices do you recommend that are configurable for different carriers?

[Didneywhorl]

The build yourself units can use all 4 carriers SIMs.

The MOFI4500 is just a $60 ZBT WE826 LTE router with either a Quectel EC25AF cat4 modem (SIM7) or a Sierra Wireless MC7455 cat6 modem (SIM4) inside. Then their own customized firmware and their name painted on the cover. You are mostly paying for their customized firmware. You can build it yourself and use free firmware for about $200-$250.

The MOFI is a turnkey product that is mosly setup for you, just pop in a SIM and change the APN. Honestly building one isnt much harder. I would charge about what they charge to build one for people, but in the case of the we826 and a low cat modem, its not hard at all to build. Its just a matter of time, money, and confidence.

The we826/MOFI is also limited to about 85Mbps, including pc to pc on their LAN ports, as they are not gigabit LAN ports.

Sprint was finally officially purchased by T-mobile and is already gaining access to T-mobile cellular bands as they merge their assets. T-mobile branded service isnt gaining access to Sprint bands just yet. The Sprint name is going away.

I personally like the WG3526P with at least a cat12 modem, like the Quectel EM12G. Sierra Wireless also has cat 12 modems. I really like the cat16 and higher, as they support 4 antennas for 4x mimo antenna operation. I personally use a Quectel EM20G (category/cat20) and a Telit LM960A18 (cat18) modem, as well as my old trusty Sierra Wireless MC7455. The Telit is one of the few that can use every single major US LTE band including B71.

Antennas are very important to me. I prefer flat panel directional antennas. They arent cheap, but they are worth it. They seem to be more forgiving when aiming, than log periods and yagis, I'm told.

[dc608]

Been reading all day and I came across your build. Router inside antenna. Slick!

It certainly seems like I'd get a lot more bang for my buck if I build my own. I'm SO glad my researches led me here. I've looked over the tutorials and it looks like I could do it. No worse than building a computer, and I did that already. It even worked!

It looks like (correct me if I got this wrong) I could put an EM7565 into a WG3526 and I could probably test the unit with the SIM card from my current hotspot and either keep using that SIM if it works in there, or find a suitable plan on AT&T or Verizon. If I need a better antenna, I could add that later.

Is there an advantage to using the EM12G over the EM7565? Anything over cat 12 would have to be a future upgrade for me.

[Didneywhorl]

Been reading all day and I came across your build. Router inside antenna. Slick!

It certainly seems like I'd get a lot more bang for my buck if I build my own. I'm SO glad my researches led me here. I've looked over the tutorials and it looks like I could do it. No worse than building a computer, and I did that already. It even worked!

This stuff is fun, and pretty simple!

It looks like (correct me if I got this wrong) I could put an EM7565 into a WG3526....

Yep! Just need an adapter. The EM modems are M.2 Key B form factor. The LTE routers like the WG3526 only have an mPCIe slot. I prefer using a usb3 to m.2 adapter and plugging the usb3 cable into the usb3 port on the front of the router, but it's not necessary. You can use a mpcie to m.2 key B adapter directly in the router. The exception to this rule is the Telit LM960A18 modem, it is in an mPCIe form factor.

Is there an advantage to using the EM12G over the EM7565? Anything over cat 12 would have to be a future upgrade for me.

I just like the Quectels much much better than Sierras. Different reasons.

[gscheb]

The exception to this rule is the Telit LM960A18 modem, it is in an mPCIe form factor.

Telit LM960A18 isn't at The Wireless Haven store. Do you know where to look for it? Was going to compare to em20-g. Never used Telit but know it has band 71.

[Didneywhorl]

I gotchu

https://www.semiconductorstore.com/cart ... uct=100408

Best price found

LM960A18 is mpcie, cat18, uses basically all bands, and can run in both usb3 or usb2 modes

Also has official firmware for all major carriers, including generic. Though the generic kinda sucks for some reason

[BillA]

I gotchu

https://www.semiconductorstore.com/cart ... uct=100408

Best price found

LM960A18 is mpcie, cat18, uses basically all bands, and can run in both usb3 or usb2 modes

Also has official firmware for all major carriers, including generic. Though the generic kinda sucks for some reason

I'm debating between a Telit LM960 and the Quectel EM20.... while I like Quectel in general, I'm leaning more towards the Telit for two reasons, no M.2 to mPCIe adapter needed (though no big deal), but most importantly for that elusive band 71 on Tmobile. What's the max speeds you have gotten so far on both (and which carrier)?

[Didneywhorl]

I'm debating between a Telit LM960 and the Quectel EM20.... while I like Quectel in general, I'm leaning more towards the Telit for two reasons, no M.2 to mPCIe adapter needed (though no big deal), but most importantly for that elusive band 71 on Tmobile. What's the max speeds you have gotten so far on both (and which carrier)?

I've gotten my tower max here, this far, on both cards. 300Mbps on quad antennas. The Telit is cool, but I still like the EM20 a bit more. The biggest issue with the EM20, is it is kind of in development limbo at Quectel.

I've tested on Tmo and Sprint only so far with these two

The Telit is a straight mpcie, but every router I've found only uses the LM960 in usb2.0 mode when using the on board mpcie slot, including the WG3526. The mpcie slot is on the usb2 serial bus. For 99.9% of the people, that isn't a big deal. I'm weird.

The Telit also cannot, yet, be .... masked. They keep that secret locked away. The Telit DOES, though, have multiple official firmware images on board like Sierra modems. The Quectel has no official firmware images. The Telit generic firmware kinda sucks for me, I cant get it to do CA. Prob user error.

The Telit is a badass modem, I just have liked the EM20 a bit more, so far.

[gscheb]

LM960A18 is mpcie

So does this mean that the antenna pigtails are the same as mc7455 then?

To load these firmware on modems can it be in a router and do that or need something else to do it? Honestly never did firmware changes on modem before.

[BillA]

I've gotten my tower max here, this far, on both cards. 300Mbps on quad antennas. The Telit is cool, but I still like the EM20 a bit more. The biggest issue with the EM20, is it is kind of in development limbo at Quectel.
The Telit is a badass modem, I just have liked the EM20 a bit more, so far.

Well the key points of the LM960 is that it's straight mPCIe, has the elusive band 71, it's a more mature device/firmware since it's been out for a while, and the price is also more attractive. USB2 (though the specs shows both USB2/3) shouldn't be an issue for most folks since currently even the best LTE connections would probably never reach over 400Mbps even with the slight usb overhead, and USB3 would probably matter more on 5G modems. Haven't decided for sure, but strongly leaning towards it, but a bit concerned about not being able to achieve CA with it... hmmm.

So does this mean that the antenna pigtails are the same as mc7455 then?

To load these firmware on modems can it be in a router and do that or need something else to do it? Honestly never did firmware changes on modem before.

Hope you don't mind me answering your question, since I've been doing quite a bit of research lately on the LM960.
The antenna connectors are the newer MHF4 type like on the EM7511/7565, and the firmware can only be loaded in an external mPCIe to USB adapter, using either the cheap $15 adapter without antennas (https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/pcie-m-2/mini-p ... -with-top/), or the $40 enclosure with antenna connectors (https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/pcie-m-2/mini-p ... card-slot/), though I prefer the later since it provides better power from an external source. I have just purchased both adapters from The Wireless Haven, waiting for it to arrive.

[gscheb]

Thanks BillA
I am torn as well with which one to upgrade too. Like the idea of band 71 but also know there isn't much band width there. Also never had telit modem before so unsure of that as well.
The Quectal modems I have had seem super easy.

[BillA]

Thanks BillA
I am torn as well with which one to upgrade too. Like the idea of band 71 but also know there isn't much band width there. Also never had telit modem before so unsure of that as well.
The Quectal modems I have had seem super easy.

While band 71 may not be much at 5Mhz bandwidth (though I've read that in some areas it's 10 to 20 Mhz wide), when being used in CA combo, it could increase speeds significantly. But there's only one way to find out, gotta try it.

[gscheb]

Surprised you looking into it. Thought you just tethered a phone for data to WG3526 router.

[dc608]

Following this modem discussion with interest as I know I have nearby towers using band 71. But the fact is, almost everything here is over my head. I think I need to build one of these bad boys, and then ask you all tons of questions until I start to wrap my head around things.

I've decided to build the 3526-P, simply because it has the PoE capability and I MAY want to use that down the line.

Gonna flip a coin to decide between EM7565 and the EM12-G, unless somebody offers a compelling reason to go with one over the other (I would find "easier" to be very compelling!).

I didn't see the pigtails at the The Wireless Haven store in the right configuration and length, so I ordered some from Amazon. That'll probably be a screwup, but I'll deal with it once it is.

And I'll need a PCI-E to M.2 adapter. This one? https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/pcie-m-2/mini-p ... card-slot/

If I decide on the EM7565, is it best to add the firmware upgrade?

Anything else I should have to get going? I'll probably place this order tomorrow. I'm eager to do this.

[gscheb]

Following this modem discussion with interest as I know I have nearby towers using band 71.

I've decided to build the 3526-P, simply because it has the PoI capability and I MAY want to use that down the line.

Gonna flip a coin to decide between EM7565 and the EM12-G, unless somebody offers a compelling reason to go with one over the other (I would find "easier" to be very compelling!).

And I'll need a PCI-E to M.2 adapter. This one? https://thewirelesshaven.com/shop/pcie-m-2/mini-p ... card-slot/

Neither the em12-g or em7565 has band 71.

Honestly never used outside enclosure like didneywhorl suggests might be easier.

Curious what kind of hotspot you have and what are the speeds of it?

[dc608]

Neither the em12-g or em7565 has band 71.
The em12 has the possibility of 4 antennas instead of two.
Honestly never used outside enclosure like didneywhorl suggests might be easier. Since you don't need pigtails or to drill holes. Just hook USB to the front of it.
You of course will need LTE antennas.

Curious what kind of hotspot you have and what are the speeds of it?

Yeah, I don't want to spring for the Telit modem that gets 71 until I see how others are faring with it. I'm going for: entry level, easy to configure, lots of others are using it and can offer advice and assistance later...as the attributes of my first try.

If the EM12 can take 4 antennas that would influence my modem decision. It's never bad to be able to upgrade down the line without replacing the main components. I want to see what kind of signal this thing pulls from inside the house first. Then, if it's not great, I'll be adding external antenna(s).

The hotspot is not a great one. The situation here is that I have a DSL connection. Have for years. Present speedtest results are 2 down and .5 up. So very slow. But the local library does a thing for folks that have lousy internet. It's a t-mobile hotspot for $40./mo. They call it unlimited, and it always works, but I have never even looked into trying to see how much data we use through it each month, or if we hit a throttle. It's a Coolpad Surf. It's one of the tiny, portable hotspots. So whatever signal it pulls can't be distributed much beyond the room it's in. But it's fast enough to watch a Youtube video about how to get faster internet. Right now I'm getting 6 down and 2 up. But it's often better than that. And it contains a SIM card that I thought I MIGHT be able to use in a more powerful rig. At least to test what speeds I might be able to get here. My cell phone service is through Wing, who resells AT&T, and I get 30 down and 5 up on my iPhone. So even if I can't use the SIM out of the t-mobile hotspot, I should be able to find a carrier that works. Then I can reclaim the $$$ that I pay Verizon for their pathetic DSL service and put it toward a better solution.

[dc608]

I double checked both the contenders for modem choice. They are quite similar, so I'm going to start with the Quectel EM12-G. This choice eliminates the question of whether to pay extra for the firmware upgrade on the EM7565, and since I'm pretty sure the answer would have been Yes, it results in a slightly lower initial cost.

Once I get all my stuff, I'll post any questions in a new thread, since the original premise of this one has become moot.

Thanks for all the input so far!

[Didneywhorl]

Real quick note. The Quectel EM12 does not have 4 antenna ports, but only 2. They are mhf4 connectors. All modems need pigtails.

Opinion, the Quectel is a better choice, pure opinion.

I have gotten 300Mbps DL on tbe EM12 with a dual mimo flat panel hugh gain antenna, band 41. Itsno slouch if your tower is willing to give it.

The recently renames Quectel EM16, cant remember its new name, is basically the lowest cat modem Quectel makes that has 4 LTE ant ports. The EM20 has four, as do the 5G ready modems.

[Didneywhorl]

Another thing. Peeps need to stop looking up firmware updates, especially on modems, until its needed due to problems. I've seen story after story after story of locked up modems due to firmware updating gone wrong, and no one knows why they are updating. The general idea I get, 'Newest is best', butits not always true. To each their own, but if it aint broke.....


Not directed at anyone in particular, just noticed a general trend.

[gscheb]

Real quick note. The Quectel EM12 does not have 4 antenna ports, but only 2. They are mhf4 connectors. All modems need pigtails.

Oops sorry got confused was thinking em20 which has 4 antenna ports. Will go edit post before it confuses anyone else.

[dc608]

Thanks for the notes! The Sierra 7565 has an option in the The Wireless Haven store to have the firmware updated before it's shipped. The Quectel has no such option. Something had to decide me one way or another, so that did it. Fewer options and a strong recommendation...I'm going w the Quectel. I understand that it has only two antenna connections, and I promise not to mess with the firmware! Oh, and pigtails are ordered, hopefully the right ones. Rest of the order goes in tomorrow.

Thank you, everyone for the input so far. I'll let you know how it goes together.

[BillA]

Surprised you looking into it. Thought you just tethered a phone for data to WG3526 router.

My main setup is a WG3526 with a Samsung S9+ tethered via usb which has band 71 and can get up to 350Mbps after midnight with 3xCA when the network is not congested (SimpleMobile running on Tmobile towers). During the daytime it's "chugging" along at around 250Mbps. Then I've got a second WG3526 for testing purposes and was curious about the Telit's speeds with a direct mPCIe connection. I might order an EM20 too just so I can sleep better at night. lol Joking aside, I'm planning on trying out the channel bonding setup at > https://wirelessjoint.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=1078&p=6982
Technically it's possible to tether two or more phones via a USB3 hub attached to the router's USB3 port, but I was looking at having an internal modem plus a tethered phone.

[gscheb]

Hello again on this one,

Starting to look into 4 antenna modems again. Specifically the Telit LM960 and Quectel EM20.

1. When you go from 2x2 Mimo to 4x4 Mimo is it a large increase in speeds. Or is not much faster than say a Quectel EM12?

2. Another question is on the Telit LM960 seen that it has 5 band carrier aggregation. But don't know what exact bands it can combine to do this? Been looking for this info and have came up short. Wanting to know if it can combine bands 2, 12 and 71?

In the past was over getting band 71 but now I see the tower got updated and band 71 went from 5 to 10 MHz of bandwidth.

[Yipzy]

1. It depends on the bands and bandwidth. If only one of the bands of CA supports 4x4 then the increase in performance is not substantial. Not worth it to get a modem with 4x4 MIMO. If 2 or more then the increase is more noticeable and worth it to get a modem with 4x4 MIMO support. As an example, I get 50-60mpbps DL with 3CA B41(20MHz bandwith each) on Sprint with 2x2 MIMO and 80-120mbps DL with 3CA B41 with 4x4 MIMO.

2. The short answer is no. Feel free to check out my post about supported CA combos for LM960A18 & EM20-G https://wirelessjoint.com/viewtopic.php?f=15 ... =20#p10350

[gscheb]

It depends on the bands and bandwidth. If only one of the bands of CA supports 4x4 then the increase in performance is not substantial. Not worth it to get a modem with 4x4 MIMO. If 2 or more then the increase is more noticeable and worth it to get a modem with 4x4 MIMO support. As an example, I get 50-60mpbps DL with 3CA B41(20MHz bandwith each) on Sprint with 2x2 MIMO and 80-120mbps DL with 3CA B41 with 4x4 MIMO.

Is there a way to know this ahead of time? My tower has bands 2 (15MHz), 12 (5MHz), 71 (10MHz). Now looks like you are talking about intra-band carrier aggregation. Which I don't have experience with.

[Viper67857]

From what I can decipher from his post, the em20 doesn't support band 71 at all, while the telit can do 2+71, but 4x4 only on 2, while both modems can do 2+12, again with 4x4 only on 2.

With most of your bandwidth coming from 2, I still think having 4x4 only on that band would give a nice increase, and the telit would probably outperform the em20 simply because band 71 is better than 12.

Like when I start up a speed test and only my b2 (15mhz) is up, then speeds are around 40mbps during peak hours... Do a couple more to get CA running and it only goes up to maybe 60 by adding bands 12(10mhz) and 30(5mhz). This is with an em12-g, so only 2x2. If I had 4x4 on only band 2, then my non-CA speeds could be better than my 3xCA speeds, while adding the other bands would only see about the same improvements I'm seeing now (technically the em20 can also do 4x4 on b30 when in 2+12+30 mode, but my b30 is only 5mhz so meh). So maybe 64-80mbps on band 2 only, with 90-110 on 3xCA. I would upgrade if I felt like mounting a 2nd parabolic grid and running more cables .

[BillA]

LTE will always have bandwidth limitations even with multiple CA's. To get truly high speeds, we'll just have to wait a few years till 5G modem prices come down in the 2 to 3 hundred range, or tether some cheap/used/cracked screen 5G phone in the meantime. ;D

[gscheb]

So e of is don't have 5g in our area. I called asked t-mobile and said it don't make it out here.

[BillA]

So e of is don't have 5g in our area. I called asked t-mobile and said it don't make it out here.

They are deploying it in new areas every day, by the time 5G modems become affordable you'll likely have it too.

[Zapingram]

Hello Billa,

I am also transitioning from the MOFI 4500 to something better. I am currently on T-Mobile also and after reading a few of your comments, I went with a setup I seen you recommended to others. I just received my EP06-A and WG3526-P. I am currently using dual Yogi antennas with my tower about 3 miles away. Receiving about 35 - 45 down and about 15 up. My Sim is from an extra phone on the 55 plus plan.

I’ll be setting up the EP06 today, paid for the firmware upgrade, so should be good there. Can you think of any specific settings I should use? Will be using pass through in a couple of weeks after my mesh router shows up, but not until then. I guess I need to set up the TTL to 64 or 65. Thanks in advance and thanks for all the good info your putting out.

Zap

[Zapingram]

Ok, so I’m am up and running, sort of. I am getting 20 dL and only 1 up on band 2. Still searching for where and how to CA, need 2 with 13. Plus how to run a band search. Kind of new to AT commands, but I’m learning.