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Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2021 8:23 pm
by derekjsmith
After weeks of trying just about everything under the sun I'd made an observation today. Just by simply changing the TTL from 64 to 65 or 65 to 64 and restarting the firewall you get a few hours of unthrottled bandwidth.
So what if we created a script that ran every hour and did just that. On the even hour set it to 64 on the odd hour set it to 65. And also restarted the firewall as needed.
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2021 8:33 pm
by LoveMeSomeCALTE
My personal opinion is not to f*ck around with Visible. They want people who use WiFi most of the time.
Using it for actual dependable internet is something they are actively working against as in they actually have Nomad clusters running realtime detection and shaping algorithms.
They are serious about booting people like us off. If the only thing that attracts you to Visible is the cheap price, look at my post about starting a group.
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2021 9:10 pm
by gscheb
derekjsmith wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 8:23 pm
After weeks of trying just about everything under the sun I'd made an observation today. Just by simply changing the TTL from 64 to 65 or 65 to 64 and restarting the firewall you get a few hours of unthrottled bandwidth.
So what if we created a script that ran every hour and did just that. On the even hour set it to 64 on the odd hour set it to 65. And also restarted the firewall as needed.
From what I seen on tethered phone set up it takes a TTL 66 or higher along with VPN. Been just using 88 just because. But haven't tried on a modem yet though. Need someone to test that out please. Try this below and put VPN on client device. (item using wifi)
Like said before free warp cloudflare works.
Please let us know if this works.
Code: Select all
#start TTL rules
iptables -t mangle -I POSTROUTING -o wwan0 -j TTL --ttl-set 88
iptables -t mangle -I PREROUTING -i wwan0 -j TTL --ttl-set 88
ip6tables -t mangle -A POSTROUTING -o wwan0 -j HL --hl-set 88
ip6tables -t mangle -I PREROUTING -i wwan0 -j HL --hl-set 88
#end TTL rules
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2021 9:55 am
by mtl26637
I do not have visible but would bet all of this would be eliminated by routing through a VPN. Wouldn't think the additional TTL changes were necessary, probably just the VPN. It sure seems they've stepped up their game to kick people using workarounds. They are probably just blocking http ports is reason it works through VPN, all the carriers use this tactic in 1 way or the other, just not as aggressive as vsbl is recently. Unfortunately it seems a more permanent solution from here on out is going to be to install client vpn software on each device on your network OR get a vpn running such as wireguard/openvpn internal on the router and directl all traffic through it.
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2021 10:00 am
by gscheb
mtl26637 wrote: ↑Fri Aug 27, 2021 9:55 am
I do not have visible but would bet all of this would be eliminated by routing through a VPN. Wouldn't think the additional TTL changes were necessary, probably just the VPN. It sure seems they've stepped up their game to kick people using workarounds. They are probably just blocking http ports is reason it works through VPN, all the carriers use this tactic in 1 way or the other, just not as aggressive as vsbl is recently. Unfortunately it seems a more permanent solution from here on out is going to be to install client vpn software on each device on your network OR get a vpn running such as wireguard/openvpn internal on the router and directl all traffic through it.
On a tethered phone set up tried just the VPN method and it doesn't work. It has to have the TTL of 66 or higher along with VPN to work. Just settled on 88 it is plain and simple. Honestly don't know why. Just know it works at this moment.
Been advising to use VPN on client devices instead of all traffic so you have control over it. Sometimes VPN won't work with certain applications. Like Netflix and etc. And honestly for that 5 down will play shows just fine.
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2021 10:27 pm
by tetranz
mtl26637 wrote: ↑Fri Aug 27, 2021 9:55 am
I do not have visible but would bet all of this would be eliminated by routing through a VPN. Wouldn't think the additional TTL changes were necessary, probably just the VPN.
If they use TTL to detect tethering then a VPN won't change that. We're talking about different layers of the network stack.
A VPN is probably a good idea as an additional measure depending on what other techniques else they're using.
mtl26637 wrote: ↑Fri Aug 27, 2021 9:55 amUnfortunately it seems a more permanent solution from here on out is going to be to install client vpn software on each device on your network OR get a vpn running such as wireguard/openvpn internal on the router and directl all traffic through it.
I think the second option is much better, i.e., a single VPN on the WAN. It completely hides everything about your activities including how many devices you have on the LAN. It's also much easier than needing to setup a VPN on all devices.
I tether my phone on Visible to a Raspberry Pi which runs WireGuard and it works great most of the time. TTL on the RPi is 65. Sometimes it's slow but it's not the 5 Mbps throttle. I can see that clearly if I change the TTL. Most of the time I get at least 20 Mbps and I've seen 90. I'm in a good signal area.
Of course if they start inspecting network packets, they can't understand it but I guess the simple fact that 100% of my traffic is UDP connecting to a single IP address could raise suspicions but it would probably be a bad PR move for them to ban VPNs.
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2021 10:30 pm
by gscheb
Edit
This is for tethering only not modem in router.
If you have modem in router look above and get that with only these two lines.
Slightly different with usbo compared to wwan0
Hello,
Here is a shorter TTL with vpn that works if you want to try it.
Code: Select all
#start TTL rules
iptables -t mangle -I POSTROUTING -o usb0 -j TTL --ttl-set 88
ip6tables -t mangle -I POSTROUTING -o usb0 -j HL --hl-set 88
# End-IP4-TTL-Fix
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2021 11:38 am
by mtl26637
I was not implying to not change the TTL at all, I was implying there isn't a reason to use a "new" number such as 88 when what has been used in the past whether it be 64, 65, 66 etc. should work. Maybe, maybe not, if anything bumping the TTL up by one should do the trick I would think since you would be adding an additional hop.
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:20 pm
by gscheb
mtl26637 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 28, 2021 11:38 am
I was not implying to not change the TTL at all, I was implying there isn't a reason to use a "new" number such as 88 when what has been used in the past whether it be 64, 65, 66 etc. should work. Maybe, maybe not, if anything bumping the TTL up by one should do the trick I would think since you would be adding an additional hop.
For what ever reason TTL of 64 or 65 don't work for me like it did in the past. Used to use TTL 65 with out a VPN worked just great before the change when tethering a phone.
Now after what ever the change was has to be TTL of 66 or higher. Have literally seen anything from 66 to 117 work with a VPN work when tethering. Just been using TTL 88 for no rhyme or reason other than simple and it works.
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2021 3:09 pm
by mtl26637
Running things through the VPN would add at a minimum 1 additional hop so I guess makes sense that when you add one or more to your TTL it works. It kinda sux that if you want the additional speeds you will have to use VPN but once you get it all set up its not really all that bad and is transparent for the most part. I just wonder how long until all other providers start following along.
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2021 3:36 pm
by gscheb
mtl26637 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 28, 2021 3:09 pm
Running things through the VPN would add at a minimum 1 additional hop so I guess makes sense that when you add one or more to your TTL it works. It kinda sux that if you want the additional speeds you will have to use VPN but once you get it all set up its not really all that bad and is transparent for the most part. I just wonder how long until all other providers start following along.
Not a fan of using the VPN's if not necessary personally. It is faster speeds than 5 up & down but not as fast as before with out VPN. Typically VPN will decrease speeds. Other annoying thing is certain things won't work right. Steaming services and my Talkatone free wifi calling and messages.
So leave it off of my tablet phone that I use around the house.
Which is why don't set up VPN on router. Like to pick and choose what devices are using it. For me not a huge deal since this isn't my only source of data. It is a supplemental to the household. Could even get by with what it is used for with the 5 up and down. Just like to play with it and try to get it to work basically.
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2021 8:22 pm
by LoveMeSomeCALTE
mtl26637 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 28, 2021 3:09 pm
I just wonder how long until all other providers start following along.
Depends on the pricepoints really.
On one extreme end of the $100+/mo pricepoint you have people who are afraid of technology and just want a home internet replacement that just works. These plans have to have a hotspot or are resold by companies that ship imei hacked devices to their customers.
On the other extreme end of the sub $40/mo pricepoint you have people who are very savvy with technology and want redundant lines. They are probably saving the more expensive plans for long term and exploiting the cheap plans because they know it won't last.
Visible for example is on the absolute extreme end of the bargain basement pricepoint - right along the ATT iPad plan that got exploited to hell. While ATT can absorb some loss and did a culling of accounts, Visible is being managed like a startup and they are going about it in a very different way.
In the middle are users who use a mix of wifi and LTE, cable/fiber internet for home - where the breakage model works great that keeps the providers happy.
Now, if Visible sells/licenses their traffic inspection technology to other providers, well, God help us.
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2021 1:54 pm
by derekjsmith
It seems as so Visible is now tracking connections over VPN. I've got my router/EM12 with a Visible SIM setup. Without throttling I get 20+, when throttled 5Mbps as most have noted and also in my previous posts. So I setup an external VPN with CyberGhost. On my Verizon SIM I get 20 minus a bit over overhead and longer latency as expected. But with the same setup on my Visible SIM I get 2Mbps. Turn the VPN off and it's 5Mbps. So at least for CyberGhost Visible will throttle even more.
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2021 10:16 pm
by green73
Can you provide traceroutes through CyberGhost with Verizon and Visible. Comparison might yield some info on whether Visible is blacklisting/throttling public VPNs or if it is just very slow transit between Visible and Cyberghost.
Do you have access to a personal/private VPN or maybe a work related one? Visible could be simply throttling known public VPNs instead of VPN connections themselves.
VPNs by themselves do not hide your traffic profile in any meaningful way. It is possible that Visible can detect the difference between video streaming (netflix), two way steaming (zoom calls), and more bidirctional "chatty" applications like remote desktop connections regardless of whether you are using a VPN or not.
Re: Visible 5Mbps Throttle workarounds
Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2021 12:35 am
by gscheb
My visible is still unthrottled using vpn warp