Wireless Joint

Hello,
Looked on here see posts about over heating but seems everyone says never had a issue even in Texas. Well I am having an overheating issue. With a WE826 with a Quectel EP06 modem.
It isn't in a enclosure though it is in the attic of the house. Will start to drop signal and just perform terribly. According WiFi fix firmware it reach temps of to 95 C (203 F).
What I done last night is raise the WE826 off the shelf with spacers to get air flow under it. Then mounted a fan next to it now blowing on it. Hope this helps this issue.

Got some question about this.
1. has this happened to anyone else out there?
2. Could this cause permanent damage to the router or modem?
3. When the specs say the operating temps do they mean the temp of the attic it is in? Or what the WiFi firmware says?

That is way hot, gscheb. The general heat issue is always asked about when installing outdoor setups.

The reason heat is not an issue in those situations is because the metal router case is removed and the routers board is mounted open air in a sealed plastic housing that allows lots of space for heat to escape the chips on the board. I DO now install heat sinks on the modems of my setups.

Well have noticed that me signal stats have decreased and my speed is slower. Could there be damage to it or is that just a fluke? What operating temps should I be shooting for?

95 C is over twice of what I see (45 C).

Granted I am not in Texas (which part of Texas are you in?) but I am not in Nebraska either.

In California desert I see ~45 C on the Quectel.

How much traffic are you pulling and what mode is it running under?

From what you shared, it seems like the LTE radio is constantly searching and connecting and that would really make it busy.

You know about the special AT command that lets you get into the linux running on the Quectel?

Non in Texas in Indiana. Just seen people in Texas saying they had no issues.
Is keeping it in the attic a mistake????????????????
Right now it is 10:30 AM and it shows it is already at 50 C and it has a fan blowing on it.

Didneywhorl wrote: Tue Jul 07, 2020 9:03 am The reason heat is not an issue in those situations is because the metal router case is removed and the routers board is mounted open air in a sealed plastic housing that allows lots of space for heat to escape the chips on the board.

Just went down and check my sisters house that I set up. Hers says it is at 66 C right now. It is outside in an enclosure. Can someone tell me what the goal is here of the temp these should be at?
This is what hers looks like. Can I just remove the top metal cover of this thing?

Yeah, usually it should start shutting itself off at 75c or so. 95 is high.

You can remove the top cover, but youll have to remove the antennas an mount or secure them somehow. I 3D print a bracket for them myself.

Put a big alum heat sink on the mod m too

Didneywhorl wrote: Tue Jul 07, 2020 10:41 am Yeah, usually it should start shutting itself off at 75c or so. 95 is high.
You can remove the top cover, but youll have to remove the antennas an mount or secure them somehow. I 3D print a bracket for them myself.
Put a big alum heat sink on the mod m too

Sorry keep beating this dead horse but what is a good goal to shoot for?
What is the max temp that is somewhat ideal?
Is the 66 c to hot?
Is anything under 70 c ok then?

Mine in the attic have strong fan blowing on it. Is that a mistake?
Can that strong wind hitting it mess it up?

gscheb wrote: Tue Jul 07, 2020 11:09 am Sorry keep beating this dead horse but what is a good goal to shoot for?
What is the max temp that is somewhat ideal?

These exact values are defined in the modem hardware datasheet. It will mention the min, typ/avg and max temps.

gscheb wrote: Tue Jul 07, 2020 11:09 am Is the 66 c to hot?
Is anything under 70 c ok then?

I just checked the temps on my modems and they (all indoors where the indoor temp is 40 C) sit ~ 45 - 50 C. The 50 C one is handling a youtube 720p stream and a zoom audio + video call with 7 people as I type this.

gscheb wrote: Tue Jul 07, 2020 11:09 am Mine in the attic have strong fan blowing on it. Is that a mistake?
Can that strong wind hitting it mess it up?

Forced ventilation should cool the temps down unless there is insufficient flow, the source medium itself has no capacity to cool or the modem is generating significant heat.

My intuition is that your modem is generating significant heat which it will if it's switching rapidly a lot because that's when the current transitions happen the most and heat is (I^2 * R). We of course need to confirm this intuition.

I suggest this:

1. Connect a logging thermometer with a digital temp probe to the modem and ensure its timestamps are accurate
2. Connect a logging power meter to the wallwart that feeds just the modem (or hook up a logging volt + ammmeter) to the power input lines
3. Have another logging thermometer with a digital temp probe taking the temp of the area around the modem. This is your control

Once you correlate these two timeseries data together, you will be able to decide whether the heat is intrinsic or extrinsic and from there we can continue.

My source of heat is the attic itself. It is super hot up there last I checked put a thermostat of there it was at 53 C 127 F which was awhile ago.
Since starting this post now have went up there and took the top cover off the WE826. Currently modem says 66 C.

Can find the specs for operating temps for the Quectel is up to 75 C it says. But then the operating temps for the WE826 says up to 40 C. So that is a mixed bag there. But maybe that 40 C is just for wifi which I am not using.

gscheb wrote: Tue Jul 07, 2020 1:59 pm My source of heat is the attic itself. It is super hot up there last I checked put a thermostat of there it was at 53 C 127 F which was awhile ago.
Since starting this post now have went up there and took the top cover off the WE826. Currently modem says 66 C.

Right, you need to compare the timeseries data to the control to really make a decision otherwise it's a guess.

If timeseries 1 and 3 match closely while timeseries 2 stays the same region with the modem idle and active, you can definitely, without any confusion, confirm that your attic is an oven and you are just baking everything in it (which includes the modem)

gscheb wrote: Tue Jul 07, 2020 1:59 pm Can find the specs for operating temps for the Quectel is up to 75 C it says. But then the operating temps for the WE826 says up to 40 C. So that is a mixed bag there. But maybe that 40 C is just for wifi which I am not using.

This is great. If you could take screenshots of those tables and put them here, more people can help you because the data would be easier to access and digest.

We will get there! At worst you can slap on a $5 peltier element onto the heatsink that will manage the temp, but that's a BIG BANG approach!

I generally only worry about the modem. Temps around 70C in the modem are just spec max, its fine to peak that momentarily. Putting forced air to it is good. I'd also get a 40mmx40mm heat sink to stick to it asap.

Might be better to relocate it if your too worried. Remove the case, or atleast open it up.

Didneywhorl wrote: Tue Jul 07, 2020 3:22 pm I generally only worry about the modem. Temps around 70C in the modem are just spec max, its fine to peak that momentarily. Putting forced air to it is good. I'd also get a 40mmx40mm heat sink to stick to it asap.

Might be better to relocate it if your too worried. Remove the case, or atleast open it up.

Thanks for the size of the heat sink. Never used a heat sink been looking into them.
In this post actually talking about two different modem set ups. One in an enclosure and mine in my attic. The attic one I have removed the top cover.
So do these heat sinks really help that much. Where that could possibly fix the issue?
Just restarted the thing now it shows it is 88 C temp!!!
Also just went and check the temp of the attic itself and it is at 53 C 127 F. Is it even possible to keep this thing cool at these condition temps?
Could heat sink possibly still help?

A heat sink and fan will help keep it as close to the ambient temp as possible, but I'd expect it to still stay around 60c if your attic is baking at 53c all day. Could you just mount it to the ceiling and pop the cable down through one of those brush faceplates?

Mine is actually mounted right below the crown molding on the outside wall just below where the antenna is on the eave. Keeps cable short and devices indoors.

gscheb wrote: Tue Jul 07, 2020 1:59 pm My source of heat is the attic itself. It is super hot up there last I checked put a thermostat of there it was at 53 C 127 F which was awhile ago.
Since starting this post now have went up there and took the top cover off the WE826. Currently modem says 66 C.

Can find the specs for operating temps for the Quectel is up to 75 C it says. But then the operating temps for the WE826 says up to 40 C. So that is a mixed bag there. But maybe that 40 C is just for wifi which I am not using.

A hot modem is actually great, you can use it to make sunny side up eggs on in the morning. lol
Kidding aside, your heating issue is probably caused by the hot attic/housing, no matter how much you blow it with a fan, it's just blowing the the hot ambient air over it. A possible solution is to mount a Peltier junction cooler on top of the modem, connected to the 5 or 12V bus of the router, which actually draws heat away from it. Then again, it could also be a defective/failing modem. Also, you may want to check the Quectel AT-Command manual, I've seen some thermal mitigation commands in there.

I am convinced it is the hot air for sure.

BillA wrote: Wed Jul 08, 2020 6:12 pm A possible solution is to mount a Peltier junction solid state cooler on top of the modem connected to the 5 or 12V bus of the router.

Not sure what this is really?

gscheb wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2020 1:46 am I am convinced it is the hot air for sure.
Not sure what this is really?

A Peltier junction cooler is an active solid state electronic cooler which draws heat away from the surface it's attached to, unlike passive air cooling which can only cool it as low as the ambient room/attic temperature. They are inexpensive, and can be purchased at most computer supply stores like NewEgg.com etc.
When in doubt, just Google it.
https://www.google.com/search?q=Peltier ... ate+cooler

I believe I am having problems with overheating as well - particularly when videoconferencing with heavy uploading needs. Mounting the modem (Sierra EM7565 in a WE826) outside might help, but it would be a chore to get that up on a slippery roof surface. I am interested if people have had success with the peltier solution and a heat sink.

I have no experience with this, but it seems that you glue a peltier square to the modem chip and glue the hot side to a heat sink and then maybe blow a fan on the heat sink. Any specific setup advice would be appreciated! Thanks.

Orvalman wrote: Thu Jul 30, 2020 11:58 am I believe I am having problems with overheating as well - particularly when videoconferencing with heavy uploading needs. Mounting the modem (Sierra EM7565 in a WE826) outside might help, but it would be a chore to get that up on a slippery roof surface. I am interested if people have had success with the peltier solution and a heat sink.

I have no experience with this, but it seems that you glue a peltier square to the modem chip and glue the hot side to a heat sink and then maybe blow a fan on the heat sink. Any specific setup advice would be appreciated! Thanks.

Where is yours located at?

It’s in a room that would not get above 80F.

Orvalman wrote: Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:12 pm It’s in a room that would not get above 80F.

Have you looked at your Temp of the modem in Rooter? Mine was overheating but the attic was getting over 130F.

It seems when I do a lot of uploading especially that it can get to high seventies Celsius to around 90. I believe that’s when video conferencing starts to underperform.

Orvalman wrote: Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:55 pm It seems when I do a lot of uploading especially that it can get to high seventies Celsius to around 90. I believe that’s when video conferencing starts to underperform.

Well those WE826 routers are tightly encased in metal. Metal gets hot and holds heat like a frying pan. At my sisters it was outside in an enclosure. But had the full metal casing on it. Took just the top part of it off and put on a heat sink and it seemed to help it. If you want to try that. (at first had just removed top metal casing and left it inside the enclosure and was still over heating had to remove it out of there. That metal gets hot and holds the heat in.) This picture doesn't show it but later put this heat sink on the modem.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07WH ... UTF8&psc=1

Thanks for this. I’ll take steps to see what helps. Your picture is interesting. How do you provide the DC power to the unit? I’m not sure how long of a cord can be run from the DC converter or whether it’s best to run an extension cord and to the box and plug the DC converter into the extension cord?

I do like the idea of shorter 50ohm cable lengths and have the Ethernet cable go the longer distances...

Orvalman wrote: Sat Aug 01, 2020 11:46 am Your picture is interesting. How do you provide the DC power to the unit?

POE
https://wirelessjoint.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=1208#p7869

Just a quick update - and thanks for the helpful responses.

I bought a simple heat sink from Amazon (as shown by others) and used the 3M tape to stick it simply to the EM7565 modem. I left the WE826 case with the lid opened and pointed a box fan I had at the open box. I have not had the temperature of the modem show above low 40s since! Very effective at keeping the modem close to room temperature.

Didneywhorl wrote: Tue Jul 07, 2020 10:41 am Yeah, usually it should start shutting itself off at 75c or so. 95 is high.

You can remove the top cover, but youll have to remove the antennas an mount or secure them somehow. I 3D print a bracket for them myself.

Put a big alum heat sink on the mod m too

Any chance you are willing to share the STL for the bracket so I can print some? Thanks

Byulos wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 5:46 pm Any chance you are willing to share the STL for the bracket so I can print some? Thanks

Sent it to you on the FB shop messenger.

You could add liquid cooling like the gamer do to there CPU

https://www.thermaltakeusa.com/products ... oling.html

Could move the modem out of the attic by adding a GOOD low lost custom cable.

Mount the modem on the ceiling downstairs

https://www.pasternack.com